Overwintering Monarchs in Florida

[Andrea]

Does anyone know any information about overwintering Monarchs in Florida? I'm 18 miles west of Tampa and have had some milkweeds and lots of zinnas and porterweeds in my garden for years. The monarchs were in my garden usually by late spring to early summer. The cats ate all my milkweeds fairly rapidly and once they grew back then I got another batch of cats. This went on until mid fall and I didn't notice them after that. The milkweeds would grow back and won't get hit until the next year.

Since the garden became a certified monarch station in September 2006 there have been butterflies and cats in the garden constantly. During the winter of 2007 it was insane as I had more cats than in the fall or now. I nearly ran out of milkweeds a few times and was releasing a lot of butterflies.

I'm assuming I have overwintering butterflies in winter. Is that correct?

They are reproducing. Is that normal for overwintering monarchs?

Are the overwintering butterfly life cycle shorter than those in Mexico? Or do these butterflies have the life cycles of the spring and summer butterflies?

Am I getting monarchs from the eastern seaboard during the fall migration? Or just local butterflies that have decided to stay here year round? I noticed some very ragged butterflies towards the end of the fall 2006 and early winter mitgration season. None of the current butterflies in the yard appear ragged.

Is anyone interested in our Florida "snowbird" butterflies? What can I do to collect data that might help to answer any unanswered question?

I tagged some monarchs last fall but is there a more appropriate time to tag these guys? I got the impression that when the spring migration started that there were less butterflies hanging out in the garden.

I love to hear any ideas, thoughts, or comments.

[freda]

I'm really interested in your overwintering issue. I don't have a good grasp on the whole migration story. Here in central Canada our Monarchs show up in late May and eggs the first week in June. We're now mid-July and what happens to our emerging Monarchs? It's way too early for them to migrate yet they don't seem to "do anything" here...we've never seen a second generation of Monarchs.

I'll be interested to see if anyone can answer your questions.

[Teresa]

hopefuly they are making their way to me here in Ohio.

[freda]

Andrea, now I'm REALLY interested in your year-round story! It just occured to me that we can repeat our Monarch project when we spend our three months in Estero, Florida (between Ft Myers and Naples.) How cool!

For our own area at home here in Canada, I'm documenting every step and every stage of our experience...dates we saw Monarchs, first eggs, first larvae and so on. I've also started a spreadsheet for other areas of the countries with the same information. It means sorting through a lot of posts but I think it will be interesting when I’m finished. Some contributors don’t indicate their location so that isn’t helpful.

But back to Florida!! I’m going to keep watching for more details of your experience. Thanks for sharing…

Freda

[Andrea]

Hey Freda,

What a great idea to monitor the goings on where you live in Canada. I'm happy to know that you are down here for 3 months!

I'd really love it if more FL people all over the state were reporting Monarch sightings and if they have cats. I think it would clear up some of the Monarch "mystery" if there was lots of info coming in.

In Florida we have quite a few sub-species of migrating species that are all year round residents and don't fly north in spring...ie the Florida sandhill crane. I'm really wondering if we have something similar with the Monarchs. I beginning to wonder if the winter cold fronts regulate where they are as since they are reproducing they need the milkweed. Who knows...I'm just throwing out ideas. One day they will figure it out.

I'm located in Plant City. Yes, that is where all the strawberries are grown in Florida in late winter to early spring.

Andrea.

[Bugsy]

Very interesting questions. !'ve always wondered about the eastern seaboard population, some overwinter in Florida? Some end up in Mexico? I've checked the recovery stats, and there have been some from the northeast.

[Mona Miller]

I found this interesting dissertation which documents Monarchs traveling down the panhandle of Florida across the gulf to Cuba.

http://etd.fcla.edu/UF/UFE1001134/Dockx_C.pdf
MIGRATION OF THE NORTH AMERICAN MONARCH DANAUS PLEXIPPUS TO CUBA By CRISTINA DOCKX A DISSERTATION PRESENTED TO THE GRADUATE SCHOOL OF THE UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA IN PARTIAL FULFILLMENT OF THE REQUIREMENTS FOR THE DEGREE OF DOCTOR OF PHILOSOPHY UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA
2002
Page 122-132
"Monarchs from the eastern United States have been thought to migrate only to Mexico; however, a new migratory route to Cuba was unveiled. This research shows that Canadian and North American monarchs from east of the Rockies migrate in November to at least three different areas in western Cuba (Chapter 2). These areas were San Antonio de los Banos, Zapata Swamp and Guanahacabibes Peninsula (Figure 5-1)."

[Andrea]

Hey Mona,

I've been checking out info on the fall Migation flight patterns to Mexico but it still doesn't answer why we have them in Florida all winter/spring.

I wrote in an earlier log that we have quite a few Florida subspecies here...ie those that stay here year round ie Florida sand hill cranes and wondering if we have some monarchs that migrate up and down the eastern seaboard following the milkweed and don't head out to Mexico.

I'm guessing that from about central Florida down south the tropical milkweed survives our winter freezes. I'm still chugging coffee as I need to wake up and head out to work so my thoughts may be a little jubbled here! But I would love to get your take on this. Also, what I find interesting is that Freda (who lives up in Canada but winters in Florida) is finding the cats here rather puny. I'm wondering if our central and southern overwinter monarchs are smaller. This would line up with our Florida subspecies that are often smaller than their migratory cousins.

I need to hit the highway and earn a paycheck!

Andrea

[Mona Miller]

There is a year round population in Florida. What I've read is that it takes a nose drive in the summer months when predators are at their peak and disease, too. Florida has a very high rate of OE. In the fall the population is refreshed with East Coast migrants that take a detour down thru Florida. The temps are so warm that they may integrate with the year round population. I know that the native Mexican Monarchs are much smaller than their US/Canada cousins. Maybe, just maybe some of the Mexican Monarchs are making it across the gulf from Cuba and integrating with the Florida population. This has not been proven.

http://monarchwatch.org/tagmig/urq1.htm
The following four maps (click on the thumbnail images to view maps) show the significant recaptures (304) in the United States that were reported in Urquhart's "Insect Migration Studies" newsletter from 1964-1994. Most interesting among these recaptures are the instances of Monarchs in Florida crossing the Gulf of Mexico to Texas and Louisiana and one Monarch recovery in Havana, Cuba!

[Andrea]

Yup, that sounds right!!! Thanks so much as I've been trying to figure it out. The busy time of year for me is during winter and spring and it really slows in the summer and early fall. During the fall I'm really searching for cats to grow out into butterflies in order to tag them during the fall season.

I've stop collecting cats in Oct 2007 due to the disease. I just figured that I wasn't helping so I'm just trying to make the garden as conducive as possible for the monarchs to hang out and breed.

I have more comments and questions and will post later.

Thanks!!!!!

andrea

[Andrea]

What I've noticed is that the milkweed commonly sold in the chainstores here in Florida is Scarlet Milkweed (A. curvassavica), which is not a native mw. It is the mw you see growing in most butterfly gardens. I do not see native mw growing in the winter/early spring while working out in the field. Do you think that we are encouraging the florida monarchs to move further north (ie move up from south florida to central florida) during the cold season due to the available scarlet mw?

Also, I've really noticed that the monarch pop in my garden during this cool season (2007/2008) is low. I planted a milkweed garden in my fiance's garden and I have noticed that most the chysalis' (hanging off the fence) looked deseased. I think we may be having a bad season this year regarding diseases.

Andrea

[Mona Miller]

Milkweed availability is a priority where Monarchs are concerned. In parts of Florida the tropical milkweed is perennial. I've heard it helps a bit with the OE to cut it back. Monarchs visiting the plant will leave spores. They visit for host and nectar use.

http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=ASCLE
The USDA has a good plant identication website. Scroll down and look at the maps. Click on the species where Florida is highlighted in the map. You can further click on the state and find what countries the native milkweed once grew in. Unforunately, with development and invasive plants many of our natives have been destroyed.

Look at the listing for this native milkweed to Florida:
http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=ASAM
Asclepias amplexicaulis Sm. clasping milkweed
http://www.plantatlas.usf.edu/maps.asp?plantID=674
Florida County Locations
There are many more. Trying to find seed or plants and get them started. The butterflies will thank you for this and native plants usually are easier to tend.

http://www.biologicalresearch.com/plants/
This website has 18 listed for Florida.

The tropical milkweed has been around so long it is considered a naturalized native now.
http://www.plantatlas.usf.edu/details.asp?plantID=1400

http://lists.topica.com/lists/milkweed@ ... %20address.
There is a list serve for those interested in talking about and possibly sharing seeds of different milkweeds.

http://www.fnps.org/
Florida Native Plant Society. Check to see if there are any gardening or native plant groups in your area. Great place to trade plants and get tips for gardening.