cats crawling off the milkweed in their containers

[freda]

We have had such a problem with predation: 100 eggs, subsequent hatching 'holes' and maybe 10 larvae. So, reluctantly I’ve begun collecting eggs and larvae and moving them inside. I placed a damp paper towel inside glass jars…a real find was a set of three good sized glass kitchen canisters in a wooden stand…placed the cut pieces of leaves with the eggs or minute larvae, and secured seamstress netting with an elastic. Looks good and they’re hatching and thriving. BUT, the containers with larvae always end up with the cats crawling up the sides of the containers and on the netting, even though they have tender, healthy leaves to eat. What might I be doing wrong?

I’m also interested in what predator is getting our very newly hatched cats. Each hatching ‘hole’ is just that, not having gotten any bigger, indicating that the larvae was snatched right after it hatched. Now I’m collecting eggs. I’ve collected maybe 200 eggs and 200 tiny larvae in the last few days. It does seem that if the cats can survive to a reasonable size they continue to grow unthreatened. When I’ve been collecting the eggs I’m noticing the huge numbers of insects in my garden: spiders, flying-type insects and GRASSHOPPERS by the thousands. Any suggestions as to the culprit behind the disappearance of our cats?

I hadn’t planned to invest this much time and effort into the rearing process but it seems we don’t have much of an option if we’re going to be successful this year. There are still four monarchs depositing eggs in our 10’ x 40’ garden and several larvae appear of the size ready to pupate. I’ve brought two of them inside for our grandsons to watch.

Last year we had great success with larvae and witnessed the pupating miracle followed by the emerging miracle. Can’t be described as anything else. However, expecting dozens and dozens of Monarchs visiting our generous garden of Echinacea and Monarda, we were disappointed to note that the adult butterflies were disappearing as soon as they emerged. Their emergence here in central Canada is around mid-late July so they shouldn’t be heading south at that time…any suggestions from anyone?

We’ve been watching and nurturing our milkweed/Monarch situation since 1997 but this is the first year we’ve actually attempted any indoor rearing. The extent of our interference was moving 50+ cats on a couple of occasions, from totally stripped plants to those that still had viable leaves. Now it seems that we’re committed to helping them along a little more. I’m very interested in anyone else’s experience this year.

Kenora, Ontario

[kali]

what I have done is as I see a monarch lay an egg is cut the whole plant and put it in a jar or vase. I put a cookie sheet under neath. I'm 2 for 2 with eggs so far but yes, something, ants or aphids are attacking them.

I have a friend who does the leaf thing but mine stay on the plant and don't wander off until they pupate.

[dzyg]

Wow, 200 eggs! Amazing. Last year I had around 90 cats the same age and was a little overwehlmed with feeding and keeping the containers cleaned.

I also put the leaves (whole leaf) on a very slightly damped paper towel and into a container until they hatch and are large enough to transfer to another container with other caterpillars.

All monarch caterpillars when they shed their skins will leave the leaves and crawl onto the sides of the container, they sit like that for sometimes up to a day to shed their skins, then they eat it and then return to the milkweed to feed.

Good luck, sounds like you are going to be buried in cats and butterflies!!

[freda]

THANK YOU VERY MUCH, dzyg, for the information: "All monarch caterpillars when they shed their skins will leave the leaves and crawl onto the sides of the container, they sit like that for sometimes up to a day to shed their skins, then they eat it and then return to the milkweed to feed. " And kali, I WISH mine would stay put! It seems that when they reach a significant size and are totally focused on voracious eating, they don't tend to wander as much. I HAVE been surprised to find cats on leaves other than milkweed, 'way before they're looking for somewhere to pupate.

Last evening I did a complete round of our plants and can safely say that I got all the obvious eggs and wee larvae which need to be rescued. NOW I have to go and change bedding, get new leaves for feeding, relocate them to bigger containers...whew, and I thought kids were labour intensive!

I'm hoping to see a lot more personal experiences online as we need all the help we can get! Thanks, guys.

[chanceychelsey]

I too have had problems with the eggs and caterpillars disappearing. This year, I have noticed earwigs on my plants. I am not sure if this is the problem or not. Two days ago I collected 8 eggs and brought them inside. I placed the leaves on a damp paper towel inside plastic berry containers. I will have to make sure the little guys do not wander out the holes once they start to grow. Maybe I will have to re-think this container idea. I did not realize they wander!
Any suggestions?

Thanks
Tottenham, Ontario

[freda]

dzyg, I've been paying attention and yes, the cats are definitely leaving the milkweed, shedding their skins and crawling back to the milkweed, in my containers. Now in the wild when I see this happen, I wonder how they find theire way BACK to the milkweed. I distinctly remember reading that the larvae have no sensors for finding the right plants, only the adult Monarch has that ability. So how do they do it?

[Shirley]

For many years I raised my cats in jars but it became too time consuming as their numbers increased. Some of the cats wandered and some didn't. I just scooped them up off of the jar with a leaf each day.
My solution was to dig up the milkweed seedlings and plant at least four to a pot, put them under lights in my garage on a shelf (where I start my plant seedlings) and put the eggs on the leaves. When the eggs hatched, the cats just went to the plants. When they wandered, they just went to another plants. That is why more than one plant to a pot and I have about 15 pots ready to use.
When the cats grow over a 1/2 inch, I put them in 2x2x5 foot cages that I made to fit over the milkweed outside. Each cage can take about 30 cats depending on how many milkweed plants can fit in the cage. I have two cages. When one gets full I start filling the other one. The cats make their crystalis in the cages and about the time they all hatch, it is time to move the cage to fresh milkweed and it starts all over again.
It is a lot less work but there is a downside. I had 99% success in jars but only 47% in the cages. I am working on that but I was able to realease 153 butterflies last year. The previous years I realased only about 50 to 75.

[10kzoomfz]

I’m also interested in what predator is getting our very newly hatched cats. Each hatching ‘hole’ is just that, not having gotten any bigger, indicating that the larvae was snatched right after it hatched. Now I’m collecting eggs. I’ve collected maybe 200 eggs and 200 tiny larvae in the last few days. It does seem that if the cats can survive to a reasonable size they continue to grow unthreatened. When I’ve been collecting the eggs I’m noticing the huge numbers of insects in my garden: spiders, flying-type insects and GRASSHOPPERS by the thousands. Any suggestions as to the culprit behind the disappearance of our cats?

Kenora, Ontario

While not having been at this for very long, I would venture that throughout the entire egg and larva life-cycle they are vulnerable. It just depends on the predator, and the predator’s size. The toxin acquired from the mw is not a deterrent against all predators.

The stink bug (aka. shield bug) comes in a few species; most preferring sap of plants but a small minority prey on caterpillars and larvae of some beetles.

I came across this in the field last year. Demise of Monarch caterpillar.
A stink bug is draining life from an unfortunate Monarch caterpillar.
This stink bug was very tenacious as it kept trying to hide itself from me, while always dragging the caterpillar
all around the stalk and leaf stems. It caused me to do 2 full 360° trips around the plant
before it stood still long enough for a couple of shots. From my Monarch project - 2006.

Have you seen any stink bugs on your mw plants?

[freda]

AMAZING PHOTOS! We have those type of "stink bugs" but ours are grey. I'll have a better look. Thank you for that post. A friend here in town caught a parasite in the act but took it to the Ministry of Lands and Forests for an opinion. He didn't have a camera and I haven't seen the bug yet.

I've read other reports of "milkweed bugs" but don't know what they are referring to. I'll go back through some of the old posts and see if I can find photos.

[kali]

I found 3 more cats today. One a couple of days old--very tiny, one slightly bigger and one feeding on the milkweed flowers, about 1.25 inches long. they will join my other two cats, one about to pupate and the other about 0.5 inches long.

released my 33rd butterfly today! i have put some velcro tape on the edge of my cage so I can open it to get at them. I also can open it and let the butterflies find their own way out. the cage has an open bottom so i can lift it over the milkweed and set it out side to release them.

[Mona Miller]

http://shop.monarchwatch.org/product.aspx?p=106452(base)
Milkweed, Monarchs, and More. Will give you insights into the bugs that live on the milkweed. Some are there to eat it, some are there to eat what eats the milkweed.

http://shop.monarchwatch.org/product.aspx?p=107872(base)
Also, the Butterfly Family Book by Rick Mikula. It will answer many of your rearing questions.

[Ailianne]

hello..everybody,
Mona Miller....thanks for the links that
you've shared,it work,
thanks a lot!!



best wishes


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