Deformed chrysalis?

[dani]

My caterpillar formed a strange chrysalis that is not totally smooth. Instead, it appears to have some separated sections on one side (see photos). The other side is smooth and normal. The caterpillar looked mostly normal, although it had a slight deformity around the head; during at least one instar one tentacle got caught near the head, looping around like it was going back into the head rather than sticking out straight. This issue was resolved in the final instar, and I'm not sure if this relates to the chrysalis issue or not.

Has anyone seen a chrysalis like this before? Any thoughts about what it means for the butterfly--will the butterfly develop normally inside despite the gaps, or will the gaps translate to wing issues? Or is the separation caused by disease? I'm curious ...

[Mona Miller]

Were there other caterpillars in the container? Some times another caterpillar will silk over the caterpillar that is hanging in a "J". Those silk strands can catch when the caterpillar is pupating and cause problems like this.

[dani]

No, it was by itself. It didn't choose the best spot to attach; as you can see it's attached to the milkweed leaf. Most of them go up to the top of the container and attach on the coffee filter. Maybe part of the leaf was touching it as it pupated? I checked, though, and it seemed clear. Will be interesting to see how it develops ...

[dani]

Here's an interesting website:

http://www.butterflyfunfacts.com/pupae-flaws.php

Looks like this might be a case of leg deformity. I hope not!

[Mona Miller]

No, it was by itself. It didn't choose the best spot to attach; as you can see it's attached to the milkweed leaf. Most of them go up to the top of the container and attach on the coffee filter. Maybe part of the leaf was touching it as it pupated? I checked, though, and it seemed clear. Will be interesting to see how it develops ...

I usually detach the milkweed leaf and pin that up to make it more level when they do that.

Dr. Fred Urquhart (monarch scientist from Canada, now deceased) found that there were more deformities in the fall due to Monarchs using milkweed leaves to pupate on and those leaves falling to the ground. The emerging butterfly had to find a place to inflate its wings or be able to get out of the leaf litter.

[dani]

Update: This lovely lady emerged today and looks normal! All legs are present and seem to work fine.

[Mona Miller]

That's a huge relief! Congratulations!

[dani]

Thanks Mona! It's a relief indeed. I was not looking forward to watching it struggle if it turned out to be missing legs. Here's hoping for many more healthy butterflies to come!

[Mona Miller]

Amen!

[dani]

Update #2: Upon looking more closely at this butterfly, she did have some abnormality around the head area. As you can see in the picture, her antennae are kind of flopping forward rather than sticking out, and they apparently could not move into the normal position. Yesterday they were quite floppy and sometimes got in the way of her feet when she was walking. Today they look better, but still not totally upright. There may also be something amiss with her front legs; all the legs seemed to move ok, but her gait was a bit strange. Despite these issues, she could fly, crawl, maneuver around on flowers, locate food, and eat. Moral of the story: not all abnormalities are detrimental. She showed no sign of disease, so I released her in my garden today. She was last seen hanging around on my milkweed …

[Mona Miller]

I have a friend who once and a while has to deal with a Monarch that can't roll up its proboscis. Would you believe that she works with her Monarchs and that some eventually are able to roll up their proboscis. She does test them for OE.

She usually uncoils the proboscis manually to feed them. It usually takes up to 3 days for the proboscis to correct itself.

[dani]

Wow, that's great! I think if they're OE-free and not visibly suffering, it doesn't hurt to give them a chance, and it's really wonderful that your friend has even helped some overcome a physical problem. Kudos to her! I'll keep her success in mind if I ever encounter a proboscis issue myself.

[Paul Cherubini]

I think if they're OE-free and not visibly suffering, it doesn't hurt to give them a chance,

Doesn't hurt to release OE infected monarchs either because millions of them survive the migration to Mexico, survive the overwintering period and survive the trip back to the USA:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QS0FOqK97Y

[Mona Miller]

Heavily infected with what strain of OE. A strain which results in death or a strain which results in a Monarch being a carrier.

Why does it matter? It matters to Paul Cherubini because this is one of his arguments for pushing the opening of the continental divide for commerce. Right now, there is a law that says that Western Monarchs can't be shipped to the east and eastern Monarchs can't be shipped to the West.

Paul is an adviser to the International Butterfly Breeders Association (IBBA). The IBBA is mostly a group of butterfly farmers. Butterfly farms are like puppy mills for butterflies. Butterflies are over bred, shipped in boxes all over the US, and released in some places that don't even have adequate habitat for them. It's called a "business". People will tell you that they got into this "business" because they love butterflies. But, how can any one love butterflies and treat them so cruelly. Perhaps they take care of them, perhaps they carefully box them up, but how do they control what happens after the butterflies are shipped. They can't. Sure they send directions. But, people don't always read those directions. And, they don't always take good care of the butterflies. Many of those butterflies die before they are even released.

[Paul Cherubini]

Heavily infected with what strain of OE. A strain which results in death or a strain which results in a Monarch being a carrier.

Scientists have not found ANY strain that cause much death in either the wild eastern or western migratory populations. Scientists have not found ANY strain that exists solely in the Western vs Eastern USA or vice versa.

[Mona Miller]

Do you deny that OE kills Monarchs?

[Paul Cherubini]

Do you deny that OE kills Monarchs?

The OE parasite kills a minuscule number of migratory monarch caterpillars and chrysalids as compared to the tachinid fly parasite. And OE has only minor adverse affects on adult butterfly survival and reproduction.

Therefore releasing OE infected adult monarchs helps the wild populations grow larger.

[Mona Miller]

Do you know what is worse than OE--misinformation by Paul Cherubini.

http://monarchparasites.uga.edu/whatisOE/index.html
What is OE.

http://www.monarchlab.org/lab/research/ ... fault.aspx
Parasites & Natural Enemies

Paul it is unrealistic for you to state that the number of Monarchs that die from OE is minuscule due to the fact that you are not out there counting the number of Monarchs that die from OE. We do know that many factors have caused a huge decline in the Monarch population, especially in the West.

Tachinid fly and OE are both more prevalent in fall. There are several species of Tachinid fly that attack Monarchs, just like there are several strains of OE.

http://monarchparasites.uga.edu/research/index.html
Here's the research on OE.

http://monarchparasites.uga.edu/monarch ... sults.html
Results of the OE study. These results are from Project Monarch Health. Citizen scientists send in samples. These samples are compiled to check OE levels.

http://monarchparasites.uga.edu/testing/index.html
Here's how to test for OE.

I highly recommend participating in the Project Monarch Health OE survey. They prefer wild monarchs. I do recommend sterilizing your nets. OE spores can build up in nets, too.
"2010 was our biggest year yet with more than 4250 samples collected.
Need kits or supplies? Please request them at monarch@uga.edu "

[Paul Cherubini]

Paul it is unrealistic for you to state that the number of Monarchs that die from OE is minuscule due to the fact that you are not out there counting the number of Monarchs that die from OE.

In 1998 I collected and reared about 1000 5th instar caterpillars here in Calif. in July and about 30% died of tachinid flies, none from OE. Butterfly farmer Paul Runquist in Oregon collected 1000's too in the 1990's with similar experiences (less than 2% died from any cause other than tachinid flies). He even wrote to Sonia Altizer with a detailed explanation of his study which showed OE is rarely lethal in wild western migratory populations. Likewise in the eastern USA I am not aware of any scientists in the northern tier of states who have collected 100's of full grown wild caterpillars and found alot died of OE or died in the chrysalis stage.

[Mona Miller]

You keep talking about what is happening in the wild versus what happens in a rearing situation. So I really don't get your zigzagging way of presenting evidence.

Folks, I hope you guys will participate in the Project Monarch Health. The data that Dr. Sonia Altizer and her research associates are collecting on OE is very important. Why? It gives a yearly perspective on levels of OE in different states.

Paul has two anecdotal accounts for one year. We know from past experience that Paul's only interest is what can make him a few bucks. Why else would someone distribute all those pesticides and herbicides. The reality is that Paul's poisons end up killing more butterflies than all the diseases and parasites combined.