Fighting fire with fire..

[crazymilkweedman]

I asked the parks person about replacing the milkweed colonies lost to an expansion of a parking lot and a covered picnic area..he just looked at me like i was crazy! "how did he know?":)..then he said "it couldn't have been many plants anyway!..I said ya..thats what the passenger pigeon hunters said.."we only shot a few!" anyway he said he'd look into it...later the same year instead of ever giving me an explanation of why not about the milkweed..they added a jungle jim..thinking they would go green they used recycled rubber tire mulch all around it..now the kids,dogs,weather and everthing else has spread the non biodegradable rubber pollutant all over the park,nice use of taxpayer money eh?!!!...I'm sick of this crap..so instead of waiting to ,if ever, clear red tape, i took a stroll along the woody borders of the park with my pockets full of Cynanchum seeds..aw dog gone it, i didnt realize my pockets had holes;)..last i checked i counted around 60 plants...but dont worry, i'm not going to stroll thru an exotic or rare plant santuary and the after all..the cynanchums were there first!!!!!!! I guess if I ever get caught(by whom I couldnt guess..the plant police??? I take comfort in the fact of how many Monarchs will be born in the amount of time (if ever)it takes them to write and enforce a law forbidding "Johny Milkweed Seeding!" peace.

[Mona Miller]

I wish we had a clapping hand smilie.

[crazymilkweedman]

I'm going to do a survey this year in that park..it will be interesting since iv'e plant surveyed it prior to my covert op;)..there were around 15 plants in 3 areas of the park and those were the only ones there ,which got destroyed..so this year should have around 60 not including double or tripple 2nd year vines. So we'll see if the Monarchs find them and start using them again. Or if the bad guys start rippin down the vines in the name of "Landscaping" ..hopefully, since i put them along the woods margin areas it will be as with other plants in other parks around here, where the bad guys aren't real good at telling tree leaves from vine leaves and left em alone!I'll keep you posted...heres the score so far for this park
2009 Park District bad guys 1 Crazymilkweedman 0
2010 Park District bad guys 0 Crazymilkweedman 1
2011?
peace!

[Mona Miller]

A nice perennial is Asclepias incarnata and tuberosa. Perhaps you need to give these guys some literature.

http://www.monarchwatch.org/waystations ... ochure.pdf

http://www.fs.fed.us/wildflowers/pollin ... terfly.pdf

Perhaps the park would be interested in creating a waystation or a pollinator garden.

[crazymilkweedman]

and um.PS..isnt it ironic that I have to do this this way? I mean a park is supposed to be for the peoples enjoyment and for getting away from metal and concrete for awhile as well as enjoying and teaching kids about nature...wish they would have used the tire money for milkweeds...just my personal opinion but i think kids would love the butterflies more than the rubber mulch scattered everywhere! and i asked another park manager about replacing milkweed he said"I don't know??? Most people ask me if they can take stuff out!!hahaha.Never had one ask to put stuff in!hahaha!"...but the best one was the gut who said "we dont want milkweeds or anyweeds in the park lawn!" are you kiddin me?..ya non biodegradable rubber is much better for the "LAWN!" , crimany!! Urban parks! no wonder they added the rubber..they want astroturf not nature. ...I made a mental note to self..when/if i get the time, find a way to get to the city meetings to raise these issues,sorry gotta jump the chain of command..ha..they are gonna love me!

[Mona Miller]

Which state are you in? Rubber doesn't have to be replaced, but is not biodegradable. Lawn oh, lawn... I volunteer at a park where they have hillsides and vistas of lawn. But, they do have a great native plant collection and a native meadow. They have 90 acres. Some of the area is covered by beautiful forests.

http://www.nvrpa.org/park/meadowlark_botanical_gardens
Meadowlark Botanical Gardens

[crazymilkweedman]

Ya thanks Mona, but its difficult to find the time to waste using conventional methods and waiting /hoping they see your point..now i'm not knocking all parks by any means but most urban parks are not replacing what they destroy for consumer convenience..thay are artificial nature..a manicured nature. For example bull dozing 5 acres of woodland and replacing that with a 1/2 acre parking lot, some swings,picnic area and 4 acres of kentucky blue grass doesnt get it for me..even if i could convince them to add a 10x10 way station plot.!!!
I'm in Ohio..and like i said..one park totalling 20 acre's had a mere 15 milkweeds and 5,000 bull thistle's.. i mean come on..they manage the lawns like pros..how about some wild area managment for USEFUL species!!! not that bull thistle is useless but the ratio is bad!

[crazymilkweedman]

the problem is this..parks like to think they are preserving things..but what they fail to see is in example take the passenger pigeons, scientists did not realize until it was too late that the pigeons needed a certain minimum population level in order to successfully breed and once their numbers fell below that they were doomed..not at all unlike the Monarch migration..if the Monarchs fall below ??? migrating butterfies , then what? no migration? well in plants take a prairie preserve for example ..certain species of plants can only survive and expand their range in conditions where the established species has the upper hand on other plants..the bull thistle is a good example ..it is aggressive and so it grows faster to shade out other species and once its dominant it quicly takes over..we'll the point is that some parks have established"wildflower area's" but they dont manage them and soon enough the more aggessive and or invasive species easily take over these little "wild flower" areas because they are too small!! and the balance is easily swayed!

[Mona Miller]

Yes and no. Meadowlark has a great managed native plant collection. The experimental meadow is not managed, but has loads of milkweed--mostly Common Milkweed, but a little bit of A. tuberosa and A. incarnata. I've been working on a native milkweed collection. We have a beautiful specimen of A. purpurascens that was donated by the Chief, Naturalist at National Wildlife (no longer alive, but his plants lives on).

[crazymilkweedman]

last post on this..sorry i ramble...someone with the means should propose that a part of a parks naturalist,conservationist ,botanist or others responsibility include monitoring AND intervening in the population densities and diversity of various "Wildflower Area" plants therein. It is not enough to simply create a small plot, call it a "wildflower Area" and let it go at that. They are too small compared to historical sizes and so because they are artificial MUST be artificially managed! Thats not a bad thing!! its the way it needs to be..think of your little vegetable garden..if it was 500 acres of tomatoes chances are that if you did not touch it after a few years you would still ahve lots of tomato plants(if you lived in a frost free area)..now if your garden is only 50x50 plot..whats that look like after just one year of no weeding etc??
like i said before one park i surveyed had a "Wildflower area" which consisted of 80% bull thistle,19% Indian Hemp and 1% other! that's not natural either!
anyway can you imagine what a great milkweed population we would have if every park managed just their own wildflower areas to include proper balance the way they manage their lawns and picnic areas???!!!!peace

[Mona Miller]

Okay bull thistle is one thing, but dogbane is a native and a very good nectar source. The meadow at Meadowlark is not managed completely. They do add native plants, they do a bit of removal of invasives, but they do want to see what shows up naturally. I've added Chelone glabra to the wet edge. I'm working on a project of introducing Baltimore Checkerspot butterflies since the spring of 2006. Anyways, even if you do manage it, you still get invasives. The invasives are being carried by birds, the wind, and water.

PS. Add some more nectar plants to the park. Honeyvine is a good nectar source, too.

PSS. Do you know about Porterbook Native Plants that is located in Ohio:
http://www.wildlifegardeners.org/forum/ ... lants.html

[crazymilkweedman]

never been to Porter but will plan a trip,about 2 hrs drive from me but the Midwest Native Plant Conference is going to be near me this year in July, so if i have time i might goto that.
like i said even thistle blooms so it provides some nectar, its just that at least around here no balance is maintained..i think some highway medians are better "Wild flower" areas than the ones in our parks!!! Just my opinion..if your going to spend tax money on fancy signs then spend at least that much money managing the plot!!! Today i did a survey of another tiny park..turned out like this--Park "Wild Flower Area" > 3 Common Milkweed(1 colony), 75% Thistle and a few natives..20 yards from the park(ie not in it) in a patch of waste land between the road to the park and a railroad track> 4 Common Milkweed,(1 colony) 6 Sullivantii( 1 colony) with breeding milkweed beetles and 5 seperate Cynanchums...lol..no wild flower sign!!Like i said i'm going to keep seeding milkweed,but standing in the "wildflower" area and yanking out thistle plants to reduce their numbers to less than 90% so other natives have a chance,might be pushing it!!!!better yet..i think i'll start adding seed to the wastelands since the plants dont seem to like signs,parks or most likely any chemicals the parks use in their "LAWN MANAGEMENT" program!peace.

[Paul Cherubini]

I asked the parks person about replacing the milkweed colonies lost to an expansion of a parking lot and a covered picnic area.

How does one go about "replacing milkweed colonies"? Have you done it before (in wild areas, not your own home garden)? If so, do you have pictures you can share with us of how successful the effort was?

So far, I don't know of any conservation organizations (e.g. Monarch Watch, Xerces Society, etc.) that has posted pictures of how milkweed patches were successfully established along roadsides, railway lines, vacant lots and similar wild or semi-wild places.

I sowed some seed along roadsides here in California about a month ago and then storm runoff water washed them away.

[crazymilkweedman]

sure ..i do it all the time..and NOT in my yard..in urban waste areas that people dont care about or dont use..goto youtube and look at my video ..my youtube channel is americannaturalfiber..i just recently saved a sullivantii colony from the bulldozing at a business expansion site..to answer your question, you can re-establish colonies many ways...seeds obviously are risky because of mammals,birds and like you said flooding and it takes longer for them to grow..although with flooding you can still get germination, in fact flooding helps with breaking dormancy of the seed. but i use a much fast method..i raise different varieties of milkweed in my greenhouse so even in winter i have plants and therefor rhizomes..for example i cut a 3-4in length of cynanchum rhizome crown with buds and stick them in the soil in the urban areas in a vertical position with part of the crown exposed. as soon as the temperatures outside reach 65+ they will break dormancy and take off!

[crazymilkweedman]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLRbkRNR1hk the link to the video..i'll make a actual video of this colony going back to the wild this spring when i fix my vid camera.

[Mona Miller]

This reminded me of going out with a plant rescue group that was having to be supervised by the Dept. of Transportation. We were being allowed to rescue before they started construction. The construction will add another lane to one of our major roads--25 miles. Here we are having to wear safety hats, goggles, and reflective vests. We walk on to the property with the safety officer. He trips on some vines. When he stood up, his finger was broken. He had to be taken to the emergency room. We were allowed to stay and none of us hurt ourselves. Most of us had been out in the wild and knew how to navigate through the honeysuckle vines.

There was loads of common milkweed in that area, plus goldenrods--perfect Monarch habitat. Later, I noticed a vine growing in one of the pots of the common milkweed. Sure enough it was the Cynanchum.