Should I move chrysalisses away from other cats?

[jen]

Hi Everyone!
This post is for anyone who rears monarchs in large enclosures with cats of various instars. I have four chrysalisses that pupated on the top of the mesh enclosure, out of the way. Two, however, chose to form their chrysalisses under a leaf on the milkweed stalk, set inside a water bottle inside the enclosure. I have seven cats more cats from another container that I'd like to have move into the bigger enclosure, with the chrysalisses. These cats are mainly 3rd and 4th instars. My question is this- should I move the two that pupated under the leaves, so I can put a fresh stalk of milkweed in the bottle? I don't want the other cats to disturb the chrysalisses, nor to eat the leaf that they are attached to! What do you guys do when cats/ chrysalids occupy the same space? Shouldn't all the chrysalisses suspend from the top of the cage? Do you recommend I relocate them? or leave them be, but add a new stalk for the new guys? This is my first experience with multiple emergences/ cats in the same cage. Any advice would be appreciated!
Jen

[monarchmama]

I would suggest moving the stalk they are on to another bottle away from the cats that are still eating and growing, so that the darling little "eating machines" don't eat the leaf down to the point that the chrysalis falls.

Then just check a couple times a day so that you can move any cats that might climb back on the plant with chrysalis.

[jen]

An excellent suggestion, monarchmama! Thanks! There is quite a bit of room for another stalk, plus I've notice that they don't seem to wander too far off of the stalk they are eating from. Thanks again, will try it.
Jen

[F3]

Another option is to simply cut the leaf the chrysalis is attached to and tape it to the top of the enclosure.

[Pat]

I'd suggest just moving the chrysalids some place where they're out of the cats' way altogether. While most end up on the lids, I've seen cats form them all over the enclosures, including on the floor when their silk pads are not so secure, and they just pupate wherever they fall. (You might get a chrysalis with a flattened side, but the butterfly that emerges will be fine as long as it has netting or screening to climb.) These days I just keep my "loose" chrysalids in a plastic food container, and each morning I do a quick check and transfer all the ones that are coloring up to a net bag where they can emerge whenever they get the urge.

[jen]

So, Pat, are you saying that I can move the chrysalis into a hoop/netting enclosure, laying it down on it's side if I wanted to? It wouldn't hurt the emerging butterfly? That would really be more convenient, I already have the embroidery hoop/net hanging cage ready for the butterflies, I just thought chrysalis must be hanging to develop properly. Please let me know, Thanks,
Jen

[Farfalla]

Hi jenn!
Here is a link to a previous thred about this topic that will help you out.. scroll down to see a pic of the emergence chambers that Monarch Watch uses. It seems that as long as the emerging butterfly can climb ..it doesn't need to hang.

http://www.monarchwatch.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=470

Hope that helps.

[Pat]

That's right, Jen. They don't need to hang. I had 6 come out in the "traditional" manner, hanging from the lids of their containers, and 8 loose ones emerge in the net bag today. I suspended it from a rib of the patio umbrella with the top open; they just climb up a ways, expand and dry, then crawl out the top and they're off. That way they don't have to wait around for me to let them go if I'm someplace else.

[Jewel]

When we first had our large enclosure installed, the person "in charge" was HOT GLUING (grr!) the chrysalis' to metal file holders on a cheapo computer desk that was put inside as a work station. Well, not only did most of the first emergers fall to their deaths because the metal was too slippery to hold onto, but this person also ruined several chrysalis by burning them with the glue gun!

I've since taken over to some extent and put an end to the glue gun. What I do now is use a bit of thread and tie the chrysalis' to this big dead tree branch I found. When it's filled, it looks like a Christmas tree. Now when the butterflies come out they have this nice porous wood to hold onto. Our butterflies need to have this branch because a lot of our landscapers don't know any better and are always spraying the ground inside the enclosure when they water the plants. So if a butterfly falls down, they get too wet to climb up and end up dying. Luckily, I've had way less deaths since the branch has been installed.

I will usually remove a chrysalis to the tree branch if I find it on a leaf that's being slowly eaten away. Sadly, we actually weren't quick enough this morning and just as we spotted it, the caterpillar tooks it's last bite and the chrysalis went splat on the ground. I figured it was fairly new, too, since it was so wet when it broke open. Poor thing.

[jen]

Thanks for all the great ideas, everyone, I think just removing the chrysalis (hardened, of course,) away from the still hungry 4th and 5th instars would be much easier than hoping they don't get eaten by the chubby buggers! Thanks again,
Jen

[Alec]

Glad everyone is helping each other!